(please excuse any typos, I'm not spell checking)
This will be the longest
email I ever write.
In light of the recent conversations,experiances,losses,
EMERGANCY VETS, re:
Bloat- and the fact that several people have
asked me my experinace
regarding Rhythm, I have decided to publicly
tell you my story. I will give
details as best I can-- and of course my opinion.
So, this will be a long
post- one that will cause me much pain. However,
if it will save ONE person
from having to go through this- or ONE dog from
lossing it's life, it will
be worth it. So, I suggest you get a cup of coffee,
a soda (or "pop"), a
cocktail <G>, it will be long..... for those
not interested- delete now.
However, if you are a breeder, ever plan on breeding,
or are in the business
of "dogs" (vet, vet-tech, rescue (you may get
a pregnant bitch) whatever) it
may be worth your time to read this.
I am going to back up to 4/12/01-- Divas litter.
It was Rhythms 2nd litter.
She was 5 yrs old. Both litters were whelped
normal. I wasn't sure if I
would breed her again. But I decided to repeat
that breeding again, because
(IMO) I got some really good stuff. I skipped
a heat cycle-waited a yr.
Rhythms heat cycle were ALWAYS normal to a "T"
(she also always had false
pregnancies-every single heat cycle). So, fast
forward to March 2002. Her
heat cycle was not normal (for the first time),
she wouldn't ovulate-- so I
tried RNGH shots (2 of them) and while it was
way late, she did ovulate at
about 35 days (she was always 12-18)... we did
3 AI's, since for she didn't
wanna stand (another first). Low and behold--
she got pregnant. However- via
ultrasound and xray, she had ONE puppy. So, we
scedualed a C-Section one day
past her due date, in case she didn't go into
whelp on her own. I had
discussed spaying her at the same time WITH MY
OWN VET (and on the lists,
they are in the archives). My OWN vet said NO,
I do not recommend it- wait
awhile, then uterus is shrunk back down, blood
vessels are shrunk back down,
and she's got all of her strength back (also
may lose milk production). A
C-section is hard enough on them- now you are
basically taking another organ
out. We discussed this at length. And based
on that, and the fact that
Witchy died the same way-- I agreed with him.
So, we did the section on May
30th, and got my one "Ichi Pie". We also
discovered "why" such trouble
getting pregnant. She had a cyst on her ovary
and another on her uterus.
They were removed. Then, that damn Ichi turned
out so nice (again IMO), and
now knowing WHY her heat cycle may have been
so irratic (and the RNGH shot
may have broken up other cysts so she got the
one), I thought "hummm, maybe
I should wait one more heat cycle, and see if
it is normal" I gave it MUCH
thought. I decided- yes, if and only IF she had
a normal heat cycle, I would
try again- with no help from anything else. Then,
either way, she would be
spayed immediatley after. SO, if she dind't get
pregnant, I'd spay her ASAP,
and if she did get pregnant, I'd spay her in
March or April, before her next
heat cycle. This was for sure "it". Mind you,
Rhythm was in very good
health, exersized daily, feed very high quality
diet, vitamins, lived in the
house- no stress, slept on my bed every night.
Well she did have a normal
heat cycle, so she was bred- we did 3 AI's (she
never did like Justice,
didn't wanna stand- but loved his son Dante,
and always loved Shere Khan-
even years later when she saw him!). I did all
of my normal things with her
food/supplement(including calcium and yogurt
ect ect)-wise. I did notice,
this pregnancy did take a little more out of
her strength wise, she seemed
weaker. NO huge surprise, since she jsut turned
7 yrs old. She had a harder
time getting up and down and with stairs. An
xray confirmed 8 puppies.
On Friday Dec 20, her temp dropped at about 4
in the afternoon. On Sat Dec
21rst, her water broke at about 1 pm (RIGHT when
my REGULAR vet's office
closes). My first concern was the green fluid
in there. I knew what that
ment. Rhythm had always taken a long time to
whelp- from start to finish-
and so it wasn't unusal for her to go 4 hrs on
between. But I was
uncomfortable with the green, and no contractions.
So I called a couple of
freinds for thier opinion. One asked me if I'd
tried 'feathering' her- and
walked me through that on the phone, it made
her contract, but no puppy. I
had OXY at home from my vet- but didn't feel
comfortable giving it to her,
not knowing if a puppy was stuck or what.
My friend say's "take her in",
and I agreeded....SO, off to the EMERGANCY VET
I go. This was about 3 pm.
When I get there, I ask about how long to be
seen. Soon after that, a person
comes out to get my descrption of problem. I
give them a quick play-by of
whats going on, what my experiance is, ect ect...
Soon after that, I'm taken
into a room- and a vet comes in. Now right of
the bat, I'm not likin this
guy, he's a dweebie, non confident person. As
soon as I start talking to
him- and he get's the gist I have a clue about
what I'm talking about
(sorry, not to offend, but not a typical
non educated pet person, and if
your an educated pet person, you know this isn't
you, but you all know what
I'm talking about)- he say's "wait a minute"
and goes out to come back with
another vet. It's a woman- who's just the opposite,
very confident/cocky
almost. So, I go on telling them both IN DETAIL
everything, Rhythms past
litters, how she whelped, her last scedualed
C section, what I breed for,
what Rhythm means to me, you name it. I told
them right off the bat not to
"dummy down" any of their discussion to me, as
I understood what they were
talking about. The woman vet feels her, pokes
her fingers inside. She's
say's ok, let's give her OXY. I said, how bout
an xray first to see where
puppies are. Nahhh she say's not needed, I can
feel up there and she's wide
open. I asked about reaching up in her to stimulate
contractions as another
friends of mines vet did (up to his elbow), and
again she said no. OK, I'm
thinking "she's the professional-trust her".
So, they bring in some
blankets,and ask me if I want someone to stay
in with us, I said "no, all I
need if for the puppies to come- I can handle
the rest", but I do ask for a
scale and some paper/pencil, since I document
everything. They give her an
Oxy shot at 4pm. 15 minutes later she deilvers
the first puppy (no
placenta), this sucker comes out in no sack,
detached from placenta- and
stronger than all heck. I thought it would be
dead, but in fact, was the
strongest, fastest suckler I've ever had outa
the box (pardon the pun), this
would be "Tiny Tim":) Rhythm looks very content,
not stressed. Is taking
care of puppy. Drinking water, sleeping.
The placenta did come about 1 1/2
hrs later. I take her outside several times to
"move" and potty.
5,6,7o'clock, minimal contractions. The
vet's check in on me very
infrequently. By 7 o'clock the female vet and
I start discussing what's
next. One more Oxy, see what happens, then we
need to consider C-section.
SO......I once again, tell her Rhythms history,
and happen to mention "this
is her last litter". THEN, she immediatly
responds "OH, so you wanna spay
her right away RIGHT?" I respond "NO-actually"......
I begin the
question/answer brigade. I tell her ALL of my
concerns in detail <again>,
what happened w/ Witchy and Rhythms surrogate,
how my REGULAR vet doesn't
like doing it (and he's a repo specialist BTW--and
I mentioned that to her,
she looked at me like "big deal") and all of
the reasons SHE should know why
not too! She gets the OXY, comes back, gives
it to her. While this is
happeneing, I had to ask "Uhmm, who-well-what,
uhm, ok, how much experiance
do you have doing this, or who has the most here
right now?" Her reply
OUOTE/UNQUOTE "Look, all we do here is critical
care, we do more GVD
surgeries than anyone else. I have 20 years experiance
doing this, so what
do you think?" Uhm.. I respond, I'm sorry, but
I had to ask, your not my
regular vet- and I'm very concerned about this.
I then ask about the spay
again- and her opinion/expeinace-- her reply?
"absolutly--get rid of it (the
uterus), no need to put her through yet another
surgery, were in there
already". I ask how long it will take, "about
15 minutes". She checks back
in about 15 minutes, no puppy, another 15 minutes,
no puppy--so we
argree--prepare for surgery. At 8:10pm, she delivers
2 puppies back to back,
first one has placenta, 2nd one doesn't. Vet
comes to check in at 8:30-- HA,
2 puppies came. I ask for herlp cutting cord
on one with placenta still in.
Cocky vet peeks in while dweebie vet is helping
me cut cord, and see's the
puppies --rolls her eyes as if she's annoyed.
Times goes by, no more puppies
an minimal contractions- again, outside to potty/poop
and a little "jog"
trying to get contractions. She drinks water,
sleeps- but one MARKED change,
her eyes are VERY wrong. They are dropping open
(with bottom rims hanging
down) and glasses over. She definantly has "the
look" as if getting shocky.
Cocky vet comes in and say's lets check her Calcium
level. Draws
blood....Thats the last I see of her for what
seemed like HOURS.Finally at
about 11pm after I've gone looking for someone,
she shows up and say "what
do you think"? I say "she's not having 5 more
puppies on her own, thats for
sure, let's section them out before she gets
any weaker" AGAIN I ask her
about the spay, AGAIN she encourages me to do
it. She tell me's about 1/2 hr
to set up for surgery. I have now been
at this vet since 3pm.... 8 hrs.
I've been dozing on floor, holding Rhythm this
WHOLE time. They come in and
ask me if I plan to stay or want to go home and
come back. I ask how long
she has to stay, they say at least 5 hours after
surgery. I tell them in NO
way and I leaving for a second. I ask if I can
come in during surgery- they
say no (I can at my regular vet) , but after
the puppies are out, I can come
in and help dry them. Again I ask about spay
at same time, again ma
encouraged. I'm exhausted mind you, I've not
slept already in 1 1/2 days. At
12:15, they come in to get her. Now, the placenta
from puppy born at 8:20 is
1/2 way out-she's not pushing at all, and her
eyes are bad, she's exausted.
We try to stand her up to walk in surgey room,
she won't with placenta 1/2
outa her, so they do get the gurney. Wheel it
in, we lift her on it. *I give
them the OK to spay* (my biggest regret ever).
As she's being wheeled in, I
reach my hand through door, and pat her on the
butt, and said "see you in a
little bit 'girl' "- we look at eachother as
the door closes............. I
stood outside the door waiting for people to
go in and out so I could look
in- I saw them preping her up on the table, that
was the last time I ever
saw her alive. A vision I will never forget.
She saw me standing there also.
I smiled at her as the door closed again. I wait.
A little while later, a
cheery person comes and tells me puppies are
out, all are alive and well, I
can come in now. Befoer I go back to puppies,
I go over to operating room,
and ask "how is she doing?" "Good" they
say. I go over and start helping
cry puppies, I have enough time to help dry and
weigh them ALL (so what 5-10
minutes?). Then I hear a yell, I know what this
means. I ask in horror "SHE
CRASHED?" (cardiac arrest), someone runs by w/
a bottle (I'm sure it's EPI,
I'm in the medical field) SO I KNOW what's going
on. They scoot me out.
Awhile later dweebie vet comes out and tells
me whats going on (as if I
don't know) asks me "how far should we go" I
say AS FAR AS POSSIBLE- SAVE
HER! So they do, open her chest up, massage heart.
They do get her back.
Finish surgery, and put her in ICU. Only to come
out a short while later, to
tell me she's gone... she crashed in ICU again.
They didn't do anything else
for her, and I doubt even if they had, it would
of mattered........... so, I
go back and say goodbye to her- while in complete
SHOCK, my jaw hung open
and eye bulged open. Not a PEEP to me from anyone
but " I'm sorry " and I'm
wanting to go balistic, but can say nothing.
Ms "20 yrs of experinace" is
looking mighty humbled-and inside I'm screaming
"I TOLD YOU
SO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!" We discuss "what
to do w/ her", feed the babies
together-- I pay my $2,350 vet bill, take my
basket of orphaned puppies and
drive home, praying this is a bad dream.
Never a follow-up phone call from them.
Then you all kinda know my story from there.
A week and 1/2 later I get the
phone call. Rhythms "remains" are ready for pick-up.
I have my friend drive
me up to get them. When I get there- the people
behind counter go get "her",
and when she comes back, say's <dweebie vet>
wants to know how the puppies
are doing. "Oh, they are all fine, alive and
well, I have a surrogate-- may
I speak w/ him please???" Dweebie vet comes out.
Give me his "I'm sorry"
again. But I had to say my peace, in a room full
of people waiting with
their animals- so I kept it down, rational, but
NOT un-emotional. (my friend
said I did really good:) I told him "This weeks
has been the worst week of
my life. I came to this clinic, beacuse I felt
I/my bitch and puppies would
be safest here. I came here with NO intention
of spaying her, and we went
through all of that. You know all of the specific
concerns and questions I
had, right down to the type of anisthetic to
be used. My bitch was stressed,
tired, and having a difficult labor-- I KNEW
BETTER-- YOU CERTAINLY SHOULD
HAVE (which he proceeded to agree but say - "we
do it all the time"). YA???
well-- next time your presented with this scenario-
(and I pointed to the
box Rhythm was in) YOU REMEMBER AND THINK ABOUT
THIS BOX. She was my
foundation bitch, she was only 7yrs old, we had
a long life planned yet. You
talk w/ your staff about this at staff meetings."
There was more, but it was
repeated things I already said. He just nodded
his head 'yes'- but I wanted
to make him realize/learn just how this mistake
could have been avioded. I
called my own vet and we spoke for a long time
the following Monday, went
through the report together. I won't get into
all that- I'm still waiting to
hear back form him, he was trying to talk to
the female vet and get details-
but thier were some glaring quesiotns he had.......
when I get the final
report, I'll share.
SO, what were the mistakes??? What would I do
different???
1.) If you have to give OXY to get the
first puppy out, and their are more
than a couple. C-Section ASAP. Do NOT wait around.
They ain't commin on
their own. Time is of essence.
2.) If your at the emergancy vet, something is
'not normal'. DO NOT diddle
daddle around. STICK TO YOUR GUT FEELING and
own knowledge and experiance.
You know your dog. Demand answers/reasons.
3.) NEVER- EVER- EVER- EVER- EVER-- in an EMERGANCY
C-SECTION, SPAY AT THE
SAME TIME. Shoot, I wasn't even gonna spay when
it was a planned section w/
one puppy. I will never if I have too section
again, spay at the same time.
I never planned too, and I let my gaurd down.
I paid the ultimate price.
I feel terrible guilt over that choice. Do I feel
like this vet "killed
her"? yes I do. And I also feel like--against
my better judgement, that I
said "ok". Will I breed again? Yes. I have plans
too- but I have learned a
valuable lesson, I am sharing with you- so you
don't make the same mistake.
I'm sharing this with you in honor of Rhythm,
her 8 babies she left behind.
(Tiny Tim, Ms Piggy, Bean, Sleepy, Chill, Madonna,
Blue and Nick).
If you made it this far, and don't have a drink
yet, you'll probably want
one.